Attracting the right people is a constant struggle for any starting entrepreneur. Sometimes, people easily fly away and move on from one product or service to the next, taking a toll on the stability of the business. How do you attract high-quality clients and not just those who are in it for the free ride? Taylor Welch, co-founder of Traffic and Funnels, has the answers for that question with the help of webinars. He discusses how he built a leverage marketing system that helps his clients achieve stable acquisition. Backed with coaches, consultants, and service providers, he uses webinars as a traffic and funnel tool to attract the right clients, the people who mean business to even sit through an entire webinar. Not only do clients get the right people, they also get a more stable client acquisition. Taylor talks about some helpful techniques to properly promote through automated webinars in order to have the right clients and repel the wrong ones. He also shares why this tool is so important, most especially in the coaching business.
Listen to the podcast here:
Attract High-Quality Clients As A Consultant or Service Provider w/ Taylor Welch
I’m really excited about having our guest on the show, Taylor Welch from Traffic and Funnels because what we talk about is the power of high ticket selling and promoting your services and promoting group coaching programs through the use of automated webinars. Taylor has been a master at this strategy over the past couple of years. I specifically asked him to come on the show to talk about why it’s so important if you’re in the coaching business and if you’re in the service business to leverage webinars to attract these types of clients, how we’re going to use webinars to repel the wrong clients away by showing what our true colors are and showing our personalities. There’s a very specific strategy that comes with that and it’s really important to make sure that you want to attract the right people to your products and services.
Let’s give my audience a backstory about who is the man, the myth, the legend, Taylor Welch. Where did you come from, what is your experience in the world of entrepreneurship, and what are you doing today?
My business partner, Chris Evans, we run the company together, he’s on the traffic side mostly and I’m on the copy and sales side. The way we met is I was doing freelance copywriting for clients, building funnels, helping people with Infusionsoft and things like that. He was doing paid traffic for a couple pretty big clients that you will probably all recognize. For a while we shared clients back and forth. One day I was like, “Let’s start an agency or a company together.” He was, “No, I don’t want to do that.” He turned me down for the first eight months and I had to pursue him. He eventually came around to senses like he always does and realized that I was right.
We started Traffic and Funnels and it was about a year and a half ago actually. I have grown the business to several million per year since then and looking to scale it from there. Basically, we help clients who are looking to put their client acquisition stable. A lot of our client acquisition goes up and down. They think that to earn more money, they have to work harder and work more hours, so we build one leverage marketing system for them and help them scale their client businesses that way. We’ve got coaches, we got service providers, we got consultants all across the board and we help them with their paid traffic and their traffic funnels.
The primary way that you helped them do it is through webinars, is that correct?
Probably 98% of them use webinars. Occasionally, we’ll throw a survey funnel in there. We found this is the best tool to not only set up the frame and let people know what you do, but also act as a filter because if someone watches through a whole webinar, they’re typically pretty serious. You don’t typically deal with people being freebie seekers. It’s a repellent too, to think about it.
I love what you said earlier about the core mission of Traffic and Funnels is help people get their client acquisition get stability. Entrepreneurs hate the up and down, we hate the ebbs and flows, the roller coaster ride. Stability is what a lot of people crave and it’s so refreshing to hear that’s the core mission statement. “We can help you get more clients, but really we want to get you stable,” because as most solo-entrepreneurs that’s what we fear. We fear the instability. It’s like, “Am I going to be able to keep the lights on tomorrow?”
It comes from our backgrounds. I tell this story all the time, when got my first client ever, I didn’t have a PayPal, I didn’t know how to get credit card. It was the most embarrassing moment of my life. It should have been the happiest moment. I got my first paying client, I should have rushed home and tell my wife, “Babe, we’re rich.” It was totally humiliating because he was, “Are you going to take my money?” I was, “Yes, I’ll just email you.” The dude called me out, his name is Gary. I’ll never forget it.
He was like, “Is this the first time you’ve taken money from a client?” “Yes, it is but I’m going to do a good job.” He had to walk me through how to take his money. From there, you thought, “You got to get the first one and then from there it’s easy.” For me it wasn’t easy, I went another four or five months without getting a client. I just did not know what I was doing. It was this up and down. Even once I got good at my craft, I wasn’t good at sales, I wasn’t good at talking to people on the phone and I didn’t know how to get leads coming through the door.
A year and a half later I was a very talented, skilled copywriter with millions of dollars in sales behind my work and I couldn’t figure out how to get clients. Once I nailed that, I got passionate about helping other people skip over that same year and a half. That’s what we do today. There’s actually a mission there besides just taking clients and make them money. We actually lived this out and it’s the best feeling in the world when people don’t have to go through that first phone call that I had, it’s humiliating.
I want to talk about mainly your clientele, because what we’ve talked about in the past is selling products on Webinars, doing direct selling webinars. We’ve talked about selling info products, courses and all sorts of different types of things. With Traffic and Funnels, you help clients get clients. Tell me about the different types of services that your clients use webinars to bring into their services so my audience gets an idea for what they can sell with webinars.
We have the copywriters, people who run paid traffic for clients, done for you. We’ve got people who are automation experts and they build funnels. They’re Infusionsoft people where they have or they’re active campaign specialists. We’ve got consultants who don’t necessarily do the work for people, but they’ll come in, typically you think of the typical consultant, like the Frank Kern person who tells people move this over there and move that over there and you make a lot of money.If you're trapped in the money ball, then you're not going to be able to sell it. Click To Tweet
There are people who sell information consultatively. Then we’ve also got coaches who they don’t even have an ROI tied to what they do. They’re a life coach. One of our clients right now, she basically coaches females who have families but they’re entrepreneurial. I think one of the biggest things besides building that webinar funnel for people is helping people not niche down into an industry but gets specificity around the problem that they’re solving for people. For example, we just breezed right over it, but she coaches females with families who are entrepreneurs. How specific is that?
You can build marketing that’s laser targeted on that. We got another guy who runs paid traffic but you can’t just sell paid traffic anymore, you’re dime a dozen. You can’t just build funnels anymore; you’re dime a dozen. We helped niche him into, he runs paid traffic for e-commerce businesses into an acquisition funnel. He’s like the breakeven specialist because for an e-com, if you can get that first customer for free, sell them again and again, that funnel is worth $40,000. It’s all about being able to position these people so that there’s no competition, there’s nobody else who does exactly what you do. From there you have a webinar and it’s like printing money accidentally. It’s like enough people expose themselves to your ads, come through the funnel and then you have a conversation to get the credit card. It’s not even a sales call.
Full disclosure, I’m a client of Traffic and Funnels, so I’ve gone through the whole process and I’m a firm believer. Hook, line, and sinker, I 100% recommend them. When I joined, I was really interested in this auto Webinar client acquisition model because at the time I was helping consulting on other people’s webinars, I was helping them build their webinars and optimize them and scale. I was really interested in instability. That’s like the primary reason why I signed up was stability, which is why I called it out early. I’m like, “I love that. I’m so glad that you said that.” Let the audience know, what’s the general overview because you don’t tell people to do live webinars for client acquisition. Tell them your rough overview process.
What does the system look like?
Yes, what does the system look like.
We usually start with the offer because that’s the thing that’s going to break down first. You’ve seen this Joel, because you’d been in most people’s ROI before they even have a webinar because you fixed their offer. All of a sudden, they’re accidentally selling people that they knew. We start with the offer and then from there we’ll build out a feeder funnel and it’s a webinar that explains the gap. It explains what needs to be fixed, what people need to work on. There’s a nuance here because with webinars, you don’t want to give someone so much information for free that they’re like, “I don’t need to buy anything, I’m just going to go do this on my own,” but you want to give them enough to where it’s like not a rip off for them investing 45 minutes with you.
We help get that balance in that information. From there, if someone wants to talk about how to customize that and really tailor that to install into their business or their life or whatever it is the person sells, then they can hop on a call with the person and they have to fill an application. We’ve got these filtration devices. First of all, you have to actually stay for the whole webinar. That’s a strong filter and then after that you actually have to go book a call, there’s another filter, and then from there you have to fill an application and if we don’t feel like that person’s a great fit or we don’t feel like we can help them, then we’ll recommend something else. We won’t even have to call. There’s another filter.
Probably about 30% to 40% of people that we get on the phone with after they make it through the application, we can tell that we can’t really help this person. This person lives in California and they’re on food stamps and they can’t even afford diapers so we’re not going to sell this person or other triggers that tell us it’s not right to enroll this person as a client. At the end of the day, what you end up with is you’re perfect. These are bullseye. We can help this person. They’re a great fit. They can afford it and there’s no selling that really happens because they’ve been through all these different filtration processes and you’re left with the cream of the crop and it just is easy. Does that answer the question?
Yes, it does. It’s super clear because anyone who hasn’t really built a funnel before, if you don’t really know what a funnel is and you’re trying to get clients, there are a million ways that you can collect applications or a million ways that you can book phone calls. Number one, you want to make sure that your time is being well spent if you’re taking the phone calls and you’re closing them on, on the calls because you can book your calendar with low quality calls that you’ll never have a high likelihood of closing the sale. Pushing them through these filter techniques ensures that you get the best of the best, which is super valuable.
It’s all split up sequentially. Each sequence has a different goal. I’ll never forget when I was studying copy reading a book by a guy named Joe Sugarman and his Advertising Secrets of the Written Word. I got that book. I’m six months into really getting good at copy stuff and he talks about everything a copy is sequential. The headliner’s one job is to get the person to read the sub headline, and that’s it. The sub headline, the only job of the sub headline is to get them to read the first sentence of the first paragraph of copy.
The first paragraph, the only job of that is to get them to read the second paragraph. He just went on down through the whole sales later. It sounds like, “It’s way more simple than people make it sound like.” It’s the same thing with the funnel, you just take the sales later and you flip it over on its side and the one job of the ad is to get them to give the landing page a shot. Go give it a shot. Go look at what’s on the landing page. That’s it.
The headline is to get them to read down the landing page. You want them to register and then that first email, that thank you page, the only goal of that is to get them to freaking show up. We’re having to sell them on each micro stage. Once you get to the webinar, the one job of the webinar is to get the bad fits to leave. We don’t even care about them, we just want them off. Then the good fits, we want to get them on the call. You have this really tight system that just pushes people sequentially from one step to the next and we’re okay that the people who don’t last wasn’t meant to be like they weren’t even a good fit.
It makes a ton of sense. I love webinars because of how much you can accomplish with one. You can educate, you can build the bond, you can do so much with one 45-minute to an hour-long webinar and at the end you give them the call to action and say, “If this made sense and you want to continue down the next step, yes, I’ve got an offer for you. I’d be crazy not to give you an offer, you clearly want more so let’s talk about it and see if there is an opportunity for us to continue down this road. Fill an application, let’s book a call because I want to help you with whatever my mission is as my business.”
I want to take a step back and talk about one of the types of clients that you helped. I want to talk about this because I’m curious on my own. I’ve had a hard time connecting the dots with non-ROI type clients like life coaches. To clarify what Taylor means by non-ROI. You’re not selling a business service saying, “I can help you make a $1,000 a month. I can help you make $100,000 a month.” That’s an ROI. I charge $10,000, I’ll help you make $100,000. Life coach is like inspiration, motivation. I don’t even know what a life coach does. How do you sell that? What are the trigger points for that?
ROI became probably most famous with Thinking Monetary but thinking back a long time ago, even today, you’ve got people that go into doctors. They you have a significant ROI from getting healed, but it’s not money. It’s the fact that they don’t die and they get to see their grandkids. That’s a pretty big return on investment. The catch is making sure that you don’t just limit ROI to money because you’ve got emotional ROI, you’ve got monetary ROI, you’ve got a time freedom ROI, you’ve got fulfillment in life goal, what means that you’ve succeeded so like success ROI.
With a life coach, we would never sell just life coach services. It is way too broad because nobody knows what that even is. Let’s take this example of like someone who coaches female entrepreneurs and businesses and families, the ROI for them is they connect with their kids and they still can have a successful business. You sell it exactly the same but the ROI is different. It’s still diagnostic in nature.
You still have the same strategy with identifying what’s not going the way that people want it to go but rather than saying, “You’re going to probably look at earning $30,000 in the next three to four months,” you’re saying, “Over the next twelve weeks, you’re going to be in a position where you don’t feel the pressure that you feel now. We identify this, this and this, and that’s going to allow you to have time back with your kid. You are looking at about eight to ten hours a week, X, Y, Z.” It’s the same thing. If you’re trapped in the money ball, then you’re not going to be able to sell it. To me, it all comes back to the doctor’s frame. You just got to diagnose what is it that people want, that’s the biggest thing, and then what is it that’s keeping them from getting what they want. That’s the two magic bullets. Does that make sense?
It does, yes. It makes tons of sense. With the doctor analogy, I love it. I’ve heard it before, but it does make a ton of sense. I don’t know why I didn’t think about when I asked you the question, but it’s like somebody comes to you and if you’ve got a tooth that’s about to fall out or infected or whatever, it hurts like hell. You’re going to do anything to get that pain solved. That’s a very physical ROI.
Some people in their scripts will actually put it in like, “Before you sell them, you should ask them, ‘If you’re able to solve this problem, what do you think it will be worth?’” That’s the fascinating question. You get some of these people who are non-ROI base and for example, right now we have a health coach who helps people lose weight, guys specifically who need to lose at least 100 pounds. He’s really helping people lose a lot of weight.
You ask somebody like that, “What is this worth to lose to get rid of this?” People say all sorts of crazy things. They say $100,000. They say it’s priceless. They say, “I can’t even put a number to it.” People get it. If you ask them the emotional stuff and the physical stuff, it always is worth more than the money stuff anyways. It’s just we’re in the Internet marketing world where everything’s numbers, so we get stuck there. Do you know what I mean?
I’ve been stuck for a long time.
If we were able to solve this problem, how much would it be worth? You put the ball in their court and be like, “How much of a pain is this for you?” Somebody says it’s going to be worth $100,000. “I want to solve it now.”
If they say $40, you’re like, “Really? Being around your kids is worth $40?” That may be an issue. You may not be quality for us. That disqualifies them.
Let’s talk about the funnel again. Let’s talk about numbers. Let’s talk about metrics. What are some of the key benchmarks? For those of you if you are tuning in right now, we’re talking about an automated webinar client acquisition funnel. How to attract high quality clients if you are a consultant or a service provider using an automated webinar and an application process. Taylor, what key metrics do you look for in terms of the funnel of saying, “This is working,” or “This is not working.” Take me through lead cost, cost per application, and cost per sale. What are our benchmarks?
We have a video that basically breaks down all of our numbers. It shows you what you want at each phase of the funnel or opt-in consumption, all of these things, so I’ll give you our numbers here. The link to watch this is TrafficandFunnels.com/whiteboard-client-attraction-simple-funnel. Worse URL ever, it’s too long. It breaks down like this. Do you want me to give you all of them? Are you looking for something specific?
How many have we got? Five or six?
Go through all of them because it’ll give them an idea of the whole funnel.
You want to have monetary KPIs and then you want to have percentage KPIs. Percentage KPIs typically are going to be a reflection of how well the funnel is actually performing and then your monetary KPIs, it’s going to be a reflection of your whole ecosystem, how your ads translate into the acquisition process. We have KPIs at 20% opt in, so everybody that hits our landing page, you want at least 20% of them to be like, “Yes, sounds good. Let me register for this.” From there, we want at least 50% of those people to watch the webinar. You’ve got 100 people who opt in, we want at least 50 of them to be on the webinar with us. From there we want at least 15% of those in attendance to say, “This sounds good. I’m going to book a call with these guys.” That would be like 7.5% I think.
We’ve got 20% who opt in, 10% who watch and 1.5% apply.Sales is all over the map depending on whatever mental junk you've got going on in your own life. Click To Tweet
20% opt in, 50% show up and then 15% of those people book a call with you. Sales or something, I play a massive part in the sales on our company. The sales side is where I really have a hands-on element. Chris is most of the traffic. Sales is all over the map depending on whatever mental junk you’ve got going on in your own life. First of all, I hate sales. Let’s just say that. Put that on the table. Joel, you freaking know that. When we talked the first time, it was not a sales call at all. In fact, I don’t even know how it works, but it does.
Our sales calls are totally strategy and leadership oriented. Our team will enroll probably 15% to 20% of strategy calls but the smaller companies, if you want to do $30,000, $50,000, $60,000 a month, you’re going to look at being able to enroll 30%, 40%, sometimes 50% once you figure out how do I lead these people through a decision-making process. The bigger you get, the more your numbers taper off. Those are all the KPIs on.
On a monetary phase, no more than $10 per lead and no more than $1,500 to acquire a new client from paid traffic. You’ve got 3D view of how the funnel’s working with the traffic. Sometimes we are in KPI on the financials, we’ll have a month where we acquired brand new clients for $900. We’re like, “Yes, we’re freaking rich. It’s awesome.” Then we had a 3% close rate and it’s like what in the world happened this month. Sometimes these numbers balance out and it’s nothing to freak out about.
At the end of the day, the biggest thing is just like how much money are you able to put into the system and how much money are you pulling out of the system at the end of each month and are you happy. We have a lot of clients, they only do $20,000 a month but they’re happy and they don’t work more than 30 hours a week and that’s their dream life. Could their KPIs be better? Yes, they could, but don’t change anything. Just live the dream and go home at the end of each day. I think it partly depends on how big you want to push because the bigger the business, the lower the margin. Always the case.
It’s interesting because $1,500 cost to acquire a customer is one is one metric that I always look at. Somebody who is listening right now they’re like, “I need to spend $1,500 to acquire a customer.” There are other ways that you can acquire it and I know that you talked about that. You talked about organic strategies. I don’t really want to get into it on this, but the cost to acquire a customer is $1,500, but if you’re selling an $8,000 program, that cost is irrelevant. It’s the hurdle that you have to get over when you start going down the paid traffic route because paid traffic is supposed to help you become predictable and give you that machine. Without it it’s almost like you’re trying to drive a car without fuel. It just doesn’t happen.
If you ask everybody that’s listening right now, to give you $10,000 and you’ll give them $80,000, who would not do that? If you really quantify this, everyone in the world is going to do this. It’s like, “Easy. How many times a day can I do it? I’ll do it as much as I can.” Then sometimes we get so granular with numbers that it freaks us out and the numbers seem too big, but it’s all an investment. There’s always a return to it.
The numbers that you gave us, if we had 100 visitors to our site, we would assume 20% would opt in and 50% of those people would watch the webinar which means that we would have ten people watch the webinar and our goal is to get 15% of those attendees to apply, which means we get about one and a half applications for every 100 visitors to the site, which is pretty solid. Then you said about 15% to 20% of those applications you would close into a sale.
The goal, if you were to take all of that and condense it into one number, you want that no more than $1,500 cost to acquire a customer. Everything else could be funky and you could look at your numbers and say, “My opt-in rates screwed up,” or “My webinar view rate is screwed up, but my cost to acquire a customer is $800.” Let’s just keep going.
It depends on the price of your program too, because we used to sell this for about half of what we do now and all of our acquisition numbers were half. We’re really looking for that 5x to 7x on the front end. If you’d sell something for $20,000, your acquisition cost is going to be higher, you’re looking for that five to seven output off of whatever you put in. Do you know what I mean? Does that make sense?
Yes. Here’s what we talked about. For those of you who are in the service industry, those of you who are in the consulting industry or you work directly with clients or you have a client-based model, what we’ve talked about is using an auto webinar to help filter higher quality clients to come into your pipeline, to come into your system automatically. These are all automated webinars; this is not live. These are webinars that are running every fifteen minutes or every hour, whatever it is.
This has been a very influential episode for those of you who don’t really know what it looks like, what the numbers look like, this is really what you should be striving for as a business owner. This is what you need to be measuring to make sure that you actually have a business and not a hobby because people dump money into paid traffic and they have no idea what they’re measuring.
This has been a great episode. I learned a lot as I always do on these podcasts, which are secretly deep down, they’re more for my consumption. I just share these interviews with my audience. I’m just kidding. I learned a ton even though I’ve been working with you for about a year now. It’s always good to just get refreshed on what the main focus is. Taylor, tell everyone where they can learn more about you, where can they watch your webinar, where they learn more about your system?Marketing is marketing. It just works. Click To Tweet
Our main URL is TrafficandFunnels.com and then our video. We call it our four-pillar video. There’s stuff about me, a little bit about Chris. Chris has four kids and he’s way older than I am. He’s 70 years old but I’m the hip, fun one. I don’t even know if that’s okay to say. You’ve got to understand because we have a personality, we make fun of each other. It’s true.
That’s one thing that I actually wanted to talk about. It’s true though, one of the things that you can do with a webinar is you can display your personality and it’s going to be another turnoff. It’s going to be another rejection tool of getting people that you don’t really want to work with. Taylor, you got a very specific personality. You’ve got a very unique personality, just like I’ve got a very unique personality, just like someone else listening has a very unique personality.
The world’s so big, you don’t need to sell to everybody. In fact, you should not sell to everybody. You need to have different filtering techniques and repelling techniques. Personality is a great one, which you can’t do as easily on a long form sales page or any other mode of selling. Which is why webinars are so great at displaying your personality because if you’re working directly with clients, you want to make sure that you’re going to be able to jive with them and you can work with them.
You want to make sure you can go get a beer with them and it’s not going to weird you out. We have one client actually, her name is Sherlyn, which she took forever to become a client. I remember asking her, because we can see how long people are on our lists and stuff and she opened every email. Do you know Sherlyn?
She was like, “I was worried because you guys say dude and bro all the time. I’m a girl. We are not bro and dude and you guys aren’t going to help me.” She now loves that because the environment is really loose. She made $200,000 while working with us. At the end of the day, you can say dude all you want if you make me $500,000 in the next couple of months. It’s true, some people don’t like it, some people do like it, but you got to work with who you are going to have fun with. That’s super important. Some people they’ll comment on our ads, “You guys are the most unprofessional people I’ve ever seen.” I was like “You’re unprofessional, get off our ads. Whatever, we’ve got our flow.”
Whatever works, don’t try and overcomplicate this. For a client work specifically, one of the biggest things people are going to buy from you is your personality. If you’re working with them one on one, they want to learn from somebody who, that like you said, they want to go out and get a beer, they want to have a conversation with. People want to do business with their friends and it’s a huge point. One last thing before we hop off. Of your clients, what’s the craziest thing that you’ve seen somebody sell from their feeder funnel, from their webinar funnel? What did you help somebody sell?
We had someone who is a feminine goddess. She teaches women how to get in touch with their vagina power. I’m like, “How in the world is this working?” She booked clients from it and she’s in touch with the goddess energy.
What was her price point?
It’s $5,000. Chris, we’d get on coaching calls, he’d be like, “I don’t know if I would do this.” She is like, “It’s what my audience wants.” I’m in chat being like, “Let her go. Let her do what she wants to do. She’s making sales.” The whole thing is well screenshot. We have a media buyer and I’ll screenshot stuff on her Facebook. She is like, “The goddess energy is so strong here, the power is meeting in the inner parts,” and stuff like that. I’ll be like, “Get us more people like these. Target our ads after this person.”
What was the topic of her webinar? Do you remember?
Yes. It’s getting in touch with the goddess power. That goes to show that we don’t have to even know what the heck you’re selling, marketing is just marketing. It just works.
I’m so glad you said that. We could have a whole conversation on awareness. Awareness sells.
People will be like, “Have you ever done marketing for dentists in the Houston area that before?” I was like, “The fact that you’re asking that question it means you don’t even know what marketing is because it doesn’t matter. It’s all the same.” You’ve got to expose where someone needs help and then show them how you can be a plausible solution. That’s it.
There’s this totally weird fungal disease that happens only to teeth in the Houston area that I want to make sure that you know how to sell.
That is very true. Since we’re going by the facts, I’m glad you brought that up. If you live in Houston, you’re a dentist, don’t call us.Awareness sells. Click To Tweet
We talked about a lot of things. We talked about the goddess of energy and how to help women get in touch with themselves and sell that via webinar. We talked about client funnels and how to filter out unqualified people and only talk to people who are super serious and super ready to buy. It’s super important. Joe Sugarman, Advertising Secrets of the Written Word, it’s an awesome copywriting book.
TrafficandFunnels.com which is where they can find more of sexy Taylor and old man, Chris. We also talked about why an auto webinar is great for stability, how to get client flow on demand and clients on a consistent basis. Even if you don’t have an ROI business, meaning you can be a life coach, you can be a goddess coach, you can be anything. It’s all the same. It’s the same process. Taylor, I had a blast as always. Any parting notes that you would like to share with the audience?
No, just check us out. Let us know if you need anything. I respond to all the emails.